Working people can only show support on the weekend, we don't have the benifit of a government job.

Nothing like class warfare to tear a state apart.

The Peaceful Demonstration is about the Removal of Collective Bargaining Rights. Quite obfuscating truth with sentence structures meant to incite anger.

Tea Partiers need to realize many parents are bringing their children to this demonstration. It must be kept Peaceful. If Tea Partiers bring violence you are sealing your own fate.

As for Working People, some of us work without pay. We are Stay At Home Parents and I, for one, am tired of being insulted by smug paid workers.

'quit' not 'quite'
Good-night.

No group or union should have the power to hold the state hostage.
By giving the state employees the right to collective bargaining we have created a Frankenstein monster with an insaitiable appetite and attitude for more and more; me, me, me,....

Teacher's salaries and benefits are way out of wack--they make more than private sector employees doing comparable work and they work only nine months a year.

D. Dawg
The Party Is Over! We're sick and tired of carrying these state employees on our backs with their Super Health Benefits and Pension Programs. Give us Wisconsin tax payers a break. It's hard enough fending for our own. Make it Right Gov. Walker, Rep.State Senators and Assemblymen, and get this bill enacted, when these cowardly Dems return from Illinois after hiding out with the Bears. These Are Times That Try Men's Souls. The majority has spoken in the November elections. Now do what you were sent to do and bring some sanity and fiscal responsibility back to our beloved Badger State. Enough is Enough! We the People of Wisconsin are behind you and support you. On Wisconsin! PS.By the way, Mr. Bleeding Heart ex-public school teacher "Get Real"' if things don't work out for you and your wife as a school teacher at $45 G's a year for part-time work ...she'll just have to quit educating 'for the greater good", and suffer with that $100 Grand job that's just waiting for her...if she actually can find it out here.

Fellow Tea Party Folks.
Remember...High Noon this Sat. at the State Capitol and we'll show 'em how it's done.
On Wisconsin!!!

"Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes that you can do these things. Among them are a few Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or businessman from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid."

~President Dwight D. Eisenhower, l952

We can start the recall process of our "negligible" and "stupid" governor in January of 2012.

- Anna, with the hater signs the past few days in Madison, I think your group should be prepared to follow your own advice. TEA Party parents brought their kids to rallies, as well. I do think it could get ugly, lets hope not.

- Jason, it's all about choice. you and your wife made yours, so what's your beef?
As for your 2nd post, you're playing class warfare. It's content has nothing to do with the subjects at hand. Again, people make their choices, as with a career. I saved a man's life once. One doesn't need to be a paid professional to do that. Does that make me better than a professional because I did it without getting paid for it? According to the content of your posts, it appears maybe it does.
As far as it costing you $5k...what's your reply to the people that worked at papermills in Niagara, WI, Port Edwards, WI, Kimberly, WI and at the end of this month, Whiting, WI as all will be shut down. Approximately 1500 total jobs lost directly and untold ones lost due to the fall-out and we're supposed to get all teary eyed because you can go out to eat? You seriously do need a dose of reality.
I can understand the the discussion surrounding the method that Walker is doing this, so similar to how ObamaCare got pushed through, but I didn't see the Public Union marching back then. I can also understand the "break the Union" issue, but your personal losses don't mean anything to me when so many folks in the private, and public sector for that matter, are the real victims.

The Tea Party's only brought their children to rallies if the children had a day off. The majority of the Tea Parties are held on the weekends because we cannot "call in sick" and still have a job afterwards OR cannot afford to take a day off!!!

The Tea Parties also clean up during and after the rally and leave the grounds cleaner than what they found them. AND do not STORM the Capitol!

The teachers calling in sick are proving that it is not "all about the children". I am appalled that the teachers are abusing our children by using them as "extra" bodies in their protests and exploiting them with their own political viewpoints. Please investigate who these teachers are and a severe penalty should be implemented. These teachers that called in sick are not the type of teachers we need to make WI a great State because it is obvious that they are selfish and do not care about our youth.

Looking fwd to saturday. We will be picking up the trash left by the union types. I hope the cameras see this, Keep it clean people. I'm proud of you all. I work 8days a week and have to make it look like 7. (Trucker) But I'll find the time, somehow to be there. Lets police ourselves and be positive. Thanks!

I respect the attitude of the comments on this board as I have not seen such on most other discussions the past several days. I am a public worker as well as my wife. I have a similar sentiment towards unions as most private sector employees as I have previously worked in the private sector. I hate that unions protect 'some' workers who under perform and are flat out lazy.

Concerning this bill, we are willing to pay for our pension and healthcare. We want everyone to know that is not the issue. My big issue with this is that if this bill passes, we will never be allowed to receive a raise above the consumer price index. Essentially our salary would be locked and only increase for cost of living. While insurance prices rise it would eventually end up lowering our take home pay year after year. While I understand many people have had pay cuts and freezes, this would make it a LAW that we could never receive a raise without a referendum. Is that fair? Would you like it if your employer said you will NEVER receive a raise again?

I realize I could leave the public sector and work in the private sector for more pay, and luckily I am in a profession where there are plenty of jobs out there(IT), but I really do enjoy what I do. I work in a school and get to work with students who learn about computers and networking, not in a classroom setting but during their study halls in a real work environment. I wouldn't get that experience in the private sector.

things aren't always what they seem Tea Partiers.
http://www.onewisconsinnow.org/press/walker-concocts-scoop-and-toss-borrowing-scheme-to-pay-for-140-million-in-special-interest-spending.html

NUPW.
I enjoy raises as much as anybody. In my 37 years of being in the private workforce I have never been given a raise (even at times when the cost of living index raises ) unless I can prove to be of move value to my employer. I've never gotten a raise for going to school and getting credits. I've never gotten a raise because someone else has gotten one nor have I gotten one for longevity.
I have had to do something to prove I have affected the bottom line in a positive way and even then it is not guaranteed you will get a raise. In my industry, papermaking, it is a constant struggle/goal to become more efficient and profitable, affecting the bottom line in a positive way is an expected way of life day after day.
Promotions are really the only way to get an increase or to go sell yourself on the open market.
Good luck in your search.

If you feel there is a way to prove that

Mr. Barve,
I'll tell you what my Liberal and Progressive friends tell me when I submit a link from groups like the Heritage Foundation.
It's a shill for the Right, it doesn't count.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Wisconsin_Now

All I can say is enough is enough this state is broke se we need to start some where. I am so SSI with no cost of living within the past 2 years and now mY Hubbi is a federal worker at the Va and is facing a goverment shut down with no pay or very little pay

This bill will prevent even fiscally responsible school districts from rewarding their staff. My district Administrators have been great and decreased our District budget 5% each of the last two years and plan to continue that. It will be hard coming up with the cut to education in the next two years, but our staff aren't planning on raises anytime soon. So many people seem to talk as if they have disdain towards their employer and think that because they have been treated unfairly that every other business/employer/public entity should treat their employees the same way.

One thing that I have not enjoyed seeing lately is how many people seem to enjoy seeing other peoples misery. I understand many people in the private sector have been wronged, but I don't agree with with it and I definitely don't enjoy seeing people fired, laid off, taking pay cuts and other things that companies are doing to workers.

Also, facts are still facts. Look at the EPI study that shows that taking the entire compensation package into consideration, public employees are undercompensated by 4.8% compared to private sector. http://www.epi.org/publications/entry/6759/
That number jumps to 25% when looking at college educated employees.

I understand your side very much. Papermaking is a tough industry. I have friends in the papermaking industry in GB and Kaukauna. I worked in Manitowoc, WI for awhile with a struggling company, so I know how hard and ungratifying it can be.

I think quite the contrary, the bill may give local control to school boards and city officials to do what they think is right." This bill will prevent even fiscally responsible school districts from rewarding their staff." You may assume but I doubt anyone knows for sure except the ones that designed the bill.
It's not ungratifying, I enjoy my work. I merely pointed out the fact that contrary to popular belief, without a robust private sector we can't have a robust public sector.
A few comments above in other posts don't seem to get it and they probably never will.

Much venom and misinformation is being spewed for no good reason. Elected officials are signing legislation into law. The bill will pass in it's current form. Total compensation of the public sector has needed to be brought into alignment with total compensation for the private sector for decades. This is only a small, but much needed step in that direction. The voters decided this, not Governor Walker or the legislature. Democracy is at work. Anyone who thinks that this a part of some hidden agenda is kidding themselves. This is nothing more than a mandate from informed voters. Elections are held every two years, the last time that I checked.

First off, this ex-teacher and his wife? Really what's her name and I will show these people her salary! The 145 college credits your talking about would most likely not get her a better job in the private sector! You can get those credits through on line classes! Unlike electrical engineers, pharmacists, mechanical engineers, architects, nurses and doctors etc. The programs and courses for K-12 are ridiculous! Yes I know this for I have studied these courses in great depth! Of course there will be teachers who teach math and science! Who actually have majored in a true subject.
And to the fellow stating he or she staying for meetings after school and not paid for them! I say bull! Your paid in your salary! Also WI has a similar extra pay program like WA state has. They call it TRI(time, responsibility and incentive) pay!

I guess the big question though Richard, and for all you other teacher-bashers out there - if teaching is so easy and it pays so well, then why aren't you doing it?

Answer - because it is damned hard and it pays for crap. I am sure that many hard-working wife and all the hundreds of thousands of teachers in America thank you for your "support".

By the way, if you can read this post - thank a lazy, over-paid teacher, right?!

Really, such a feeble attempt at sarcasm!
Read in whole what I posted then get back to me!
Really we make things expensive when we work at least 25% longer per year than teachers! When we contribute at min 20% to our health care and at least 20% to our retirement on avg! When state employee unions (along with other unions) bargain for prevailing wages, when people are forced to arbitrate you dare blame us!
You blame us? When the avg teacher in WI is making 89k for what 190 contracted work days!

Let's not forget about the other perks state employees and teachers receive, lower interest loans(auto and home loans), insurance rates, cell phone, home phone discounts(sorry if your not taking advantage of these perks)

Now let's tackle this education issue you presented!
First off let's start with the 10 credits your talking about! Easy to achieve, its done on line at home or even a couple of classes or courses! Not a big deal! I did it! Secondly, you are reimbursed, your taxable income for the year is reduced at the end of the year. Any loans taken out are a deduction at the end of the year! Another thing they receive are grants and interest free loans! Again these perks are available to you as well! Maybe you are not looking in the right spot!

Now on to why I am not a teacher, has nothing to do with the pay! I have many family members who are teacher here in WA(avg pay 60k/182 days 29k less than WI) and on the East coast, they had pushed for me to teach! I am in the IT filed(infrastructure/networking working 6 12hr days mind you) and chose to roll with the alternative pathways to teach! I did not continue because I would be forced to join the union, something I will never do, again I do not believe in forced arbitration and the rape of our people!

Hey there buddy did you know since the early 70's teachers had the lowest SAT scores out of any profession! Now teachers attending state colleges or online colleges do not have to take the SAT'S! Curious how that came to be!
Oh wanted to state another thing, my 13yr old son teaches science to 3,4 and 5th graders! Oh by the way he took the WEST-B and scored 79% and the WEST-E and scored 75% of what was needed for passing! These test are what teachers must pass to become cert. teachers in WA! Interesting isn't it? Of course you will say that it took a teacher, no it took a different way of teaching!
The education teachers receive is a joke (general education, early childhood development, special education, K-12)! My cousin has a masters in
education which she received online through University of Phoenix! Come on really, she barely graduated high school! I asked her a simple question when we all were at dinner(which she paid for) what's 40% of 75? I could not believe what I heard, 35 she replied! Really!
Yeah yeah I know that's one teacher!

Our children should not be used as pawns for personal, political or financial manipulation!

My wife has a very lucrative job, she is a cremationist, one would think that working in this field she would make quite the wage! Unfortunately that's not the case she actually earns what the avg person in WA makes, that's $16 per hour! My mother who's been in the same field for the last 40yrs makes the same pay as my wife! She works in nursing homes! I am not complaining about that, she had her chance to use her education but chose not to, her fault! But before you chastise the private sector you should really look at the people less fortunate, people who are not teachers, state worker or federal employees! Really look! I am not saying that your wife is a bad teacher she may be outstanding, but when we get down to it teacher, state and federal employees are protected! Protected by unions and politicians!

You can sit there and tell me that these teachers of this failing education system in a whole deserve these outlandish salaries and benefits. You tell the taxpayers to reward failure! Let's look at some facts! The US is ranked in math 30 of 65 countries who were involved in the PISA, science 23 and reading 17! Really!

Or this little bit! Almost 62% of the student who started college right out of high school last year had to take 2 or more remedial! Shouldn't they have learned that in high school!
Here in WA we have about a 74% grad rate! That doesn't mean much! Oh yes 100% of them are pushed to attend college and yet more than 70% are not ready or do not have the education or ability to attend! I wonder why? Oh must be teacher pay!

richard, all good points. I love how the extremists like @progressiveec have to go to extreme (hence the label extremist) to try to prove a point.

Public Schools or Home School? There is no other choice? One, as you detailed, has an abysmal record in educating our young and one is growing because of the results of it. I'll let you figure out which is which based on these 2 facts alone.
BUT! I have a solution, middle ground. Private Schools. The voucher system. Send your kid to either public or private and nobody will bitch about teachers pay, performance, tenure, attitude, long hours, summer school and the list goes on and on. WI allows a certain dollar amount per student for schooling. Depending on where that student goes to school, those tax dollars go to that school.
Is it a fight for School Choice over tax dollars or is it about what's best for the kids?
Read up on it and make your own choice to support or not support it.

I totally support the voucher system, south america, Sweden, switzerland and so on... have voucher system in play and it doing very very good! I would send my son to private school now I would be paying twice, my tax dollars would be paying for public schools then I would be paying for tuition for private school!
I am involved in a program here in WA pushing for the right of charter schools and a voucher system! See the teachers and unions knew that the voucher system was on its way in so they got together and made charter schools(for the most part a back up program, a very strategic move on their part)but with voucher the possibility of a great education system and the collapse of the union in education is at hand!
I am involved in another program, Lancaster system of Education! More on that later

oh, you don't need to be Catholic to attend, or even belief in God for that matter.

Richard, since you are obviously a Tea Party follower you probably do not believe in equal rights for all, especially minorities, but . . . "The Labor Movement was the principal force that transformed misery and despair into hope and progress." - Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

By the way - tea parties are for little girls. Grow up and move forward.

May 2, 1933 - Adolf Hitler, utilizing Storm Troopers and police, forcibly merges all German labor unions with the Nazi organization, the German Labor Front. Independent labor representation is thus abolished and striking is outlawed.

Fascism has reached WI.

This just in from the AP wire . . . "The only bit of union support for Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker is evaporating as the executive board president of the Wisconsin Law Enforcement Association expressed regret for their earlier endorsement of Walker.� The union went one step further and even apologized for it..."

Also, "Meanwhile members of the police and firefighters unions member marched Sunday in a sixth day of protest and in support of those unions whose benefits and rights are in the cross-hairs. And the Madison Chamber of Commerce is losing patience with Walker as well, suggesting his remaining supporters come from outside of Wisconsin, such as the powerful Koch brothers, Walker's second largest campaign contributor."

Why are conservatives always siding with big business (Koch brothers) instead of middle class families and working people?

First off before you try and quote Hitler you should really very carefully read the whole script! Now your just being ignorant! Secondly if any I am more libertarian than anything! Thirdly your now bringing race into this debate and attacking personally now I suggest you look up the term adhominem!
Fourth, when doctor King was speaking of the Labor movement he was not speaking of unions! Only in the last 30 plus yrs have the Labor unions been fair with minorities! You really need to study your history! Quit regurgitating what you hear from the paper, the unions and think for yourself! Again we have come with ideas to fix the education failure and nothing is fixed because of the blocking unions!
Present me something that you think that will work! Bring facts, figures ideas to the table!

I will repost soon! I must attend to my career now! Some of us must work the weekends so we can provide for our families! Just another not will quick! 72 hrs per week is what I work! 50 hrs per week is what my wife works!

According to ABCNews.com:

The average annual wage if the Private (total sector) is $45,155
The average Private Sector CPA earns $71,216
The average annual wage of a public school teacher is $41,113.

I for a fact know that my wife has a broader, more well-rounded higher education than my CPA, but yet she earns $30,000 less per year. But damn, those benefits of a decent health insurance plan really make up that loss doesn't it?

Instead of attacking teachers for negotiating for a decent health care plan, why not attack health insurance companies for raping the wallets of the taxpayer?

Alright folks, this may be a bit of a shock to you but the state employees of WI have been pushed in front of the railroad tracks in favor of Scott Walker's 2nd largest campaign donors, the ultra-rich Koch brothers. This is straight from the 10 o'clock news on channel 4 in Milwaukee and is now popping up all over the internet.

"According to Wisconsin campaign finance filings, Walker's gubernatorial campaign received $43,000 from the Koch Industries PAC during the 2010 election."

And . . . right out of the budget bill itself, . . .

"the department may sell any state-owned heating, cooling, and power plant or may contract with a private entity for the operation of any such plant, with or without solicitation of bids, for any amount that the department determines to be in the best interest of the state."

Why is this a problem and a conflict of interest for Scott Walker and the Republicans? Because Koch Industries owns a coal company subsidiary with facilities in Green Bay, Manitowoc, Ashland and Sheboygan; six timber plants throughout the state; and a large network of pipelines in Wisconsin. And who do you think will get these plants at very low rates? The Koch brothers of course, who According to the EPA are huge polluters, emitting thousands of pounds of toxic pollutants. As soon as he got into office, Walker started cutting environmental regulations and appointed a Republican known for her disregard for environmental regulations to lead the Department of Natural Resources.

Now who will be losing the PR battle in WI?

Every point I have brought out you have ignored! ABCnews! Really! Oh no not them! Who do the major networks side with! You should really do your research! Quit the regurgitated posts man! All your doing is making it hard for me to conversate with you!
A well rounded education! Interesting! Her masters in what? And again you are reimbursed through tax deductions, taxable income that is lowered etc... Read above!
Oh another thing, DICK that's original another feeble attempt at sarcasm! Adhominem, again look it up! Again you will not try to bring forth solutions, ideas for solutions!
Oh 50+ hrs which she gets paid for! What school district does she work in! Let me post the info here! Maybe she does make the base salary of 45k! We shall see!
Another thing! Before I started my own business my wife was supporting a 3 person family on the avg income that's 16 per hour/32k year. Now you just said you are trying to supp a 4 person family with 1 salary of 45k and another salary of 70k?! Apparently you all are doing pretty good! Again the avg income for the avg joe/jane is 32k per year!

Poll of potential voters: For the Bill 48%, against the Bill 38%. Was conducted today.
Reported by the most far Left news source out there...the Huffington Post. PR? yeah, it's currently on Walkers side.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/social/hrpmap/what-should-wisconsin-dems-have-done_n_826057_78185238.html

Bravo Scotch!!
After starting my bus. I did hire out of the electrical union, I had to stop, I could not afford the high wages and benefits I had to pay for! I could get the same quality of work and pay a much cheaper wage, which mind you is still well above the avg wage here and the temp and full time employees were very happy to get that wage!

Is that so! Cracker jack box! The easiest degree one can receive in college is an education degree! Again the masters degree is 80% gained by online courses/colleges!
I know exactly what they earn here! As a matter of fact I am looking at the ACTUAL salaries of our school teachers here in WA in every school district! There is a difference between what they can minimally make and what they actually make!
As for beer, I do not drink, well maybe a glass of wine here or there! SUV, nope my wife drives a 2004 aveo, I drive a 98 mazda p/u! Sorry! Saving a few bucks was not the problem, surviving was the issue! Unions have drove the cost of doing bus. in the US up drastically! Unions have put small businesses out of bus. And another thing, 70hrs per week at let's say 10 per hour what's that around 33k not including overtime, now add on the 45k and you cannot survive on that? Your having a hard time?
Now do some more research on your last post of the degrees earned and all the info that comes with it and we will continue!

Straight from the USA Today ( a known conservative-leaning publication)

MADISON, Wis. (AP) — Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker has been lured into a conversation about his strategy to cripple public employee unions by a prank caller pretending to be a billionaire Republican donor.Walker spokesman Cullen Werwie confirms the governor is on audio of the call posted Wednesday on the website of the Buffalo Beast, a left-leaning New York newspaper.

The governor believes the caller is conservative businessman David Koch. He talks about plans for layoff notices and what can be done to punish lawmakers who've left the state. The caller suggests Walker take a baseball bat when meeting with Democrats. Walker jokes he has "a slugger with my name on it."

Brothers David and Charles Koch have given millions to support Americans For Prosperity, which has launched a $320,000 ad campaign supporting Walker.

Again, why do Republicans always side with big business while breaking the backs of the working class?

Class warfare has begun and it started right here in WI.

Also from the USA Today

"MADISON, Wis. — Americans strongly oppose laws taking away the collective bargaining power of public employee unions, according to a new USA TODAY/Gallup Poll. The poll found 61% would oppose a law in their state similar to such a proposal in Wisconsin, compared with 33% who would favor such a law."

And yes, collective bargaining rights IS the issue, not the $!

Richard, i do hope you come back to discussion because you make sense.